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I have a toilet on which the ball cock or stopper always falls too soon, leaving a fair amount of water still in the tank and rendering the flush less effective.
Swapping parts does not seem to solve the problem. What does it take to make those things float until the tank is empty?
Swapping parts does not seem to solve the problem. What does it take to make those things float until the tank is empty?
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Re: Toilet ball cock falls too soon
Fri, August 12, 2005 - 10:51 AMi know you say you've tried swapping parts, but have you tried a more bouyant stopper?
can you tell what appears to be causing it to drop too quickly - is it too much flow or is it just not floating enough?
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Re: Toilet ball cock falls too soon
Fri, August 12, 2005 - 6:16 PMchange the length of the chain
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Re: Toilet ball cock falls too soon
Fri, August 12, 2005 - 6:28 PMscrew around with the length of the chain leading from the handle to the ball cosk.
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Re: Toilet ball cock falls too soon
Fri, August 12, 2005 - 6:36 PMI don't think making the chain longer would do anything more than not even allow you to lift the stopper. Shortening the chain may not let it seat properly.
I think buoyancy is the thing here.
More buoyancy would keep the stopper from seating too soon.
Do you have one of those soft rubber hollow stoppers that perhaps may have gotten slightly flooded? -
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Re: Toilet ball cock falls too soon
Sun, August 14, 2005 - 2:51 PMYah screwing around with the chain alters the jerk factor and the recovery time .
Those styrofoam bobs that you can put on the chain do the same thing Just with less finness. -
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Re: Toilet ball cock falls too soon
Mon, August 15, 2005 - 2:20 PMI've tried changing the length of the chain, with no effect. Everything seems to be in good repair, nothing is worn out or water logged.
Maybe I am making a mistaken assumption. Is all of the water in the tank supposed to go into the flush, or is it normal for the ball cock to fall while there is still an inch of water or so left in the tank?
The tank does fill up to the fill line, so I know there is enough water going in to start with.
My tenant complains the toilet does not flush well. I don't think it is a drain line problem. The toilet is not backing up, but my tenant complains it consistently takes several flushes.
It is not a new toilet. It has the standard capacity of the older toilets. -
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Re: Toilet ball cock falls too soon
Tue, August 16, 2005 - 1:22 AMThere’s usually some water left in the bottom of the tank when to stopper closes and the tank begins to refill, so that’s not a problem.
Does the tank seem to empty in a timely manner? I’ve never heard of this, but I’m thinking that the little holes around the rim that send water down may be starting to occlude because of some calcification. If that’s the case, then cleaning those little holes, either with some tiny brush or some sort of cleansing solution may increase the flush thrust.
If your thinking of replacing the entire toilet, there is a Swedish (I think) tank and bowl set up that uses a lot less water and has a really. Dramatically potent flush. I can’t remember the name of the manufacturer though.
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Re: Toilet ball cock falls too soon
Tue, August 16, 2005 - 2:28 PMThe chain is supposed to pull the stopper up and raise it enough that it stays up.
Various flotation or position methods are: a foam plug or a hollow sealed plastic vessle full of air, some have a small volume from which water will drain out ( through a hole) as the level in the tank falls. Others rely on the polymer itself as being lighter than water.
When the water falls the stopper does too.
The chain must lift it though but not with so much force (usually caused by a short chain) that it hits the top of its travel and bounces back to a slightly more forward ( falling) position.
If all else fails affix a small chunk of styrofoam to the chain about an inch up from the stopper. Do it so you can change the position or swap out to a larger piece of foam.
I'd start with tape then find a more permanent solution when I dfound the right position and size.
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Re: Toilet ball cock falls too soon
Tue, August 16, 2005 - 2:30 PMas an aside these tank stopper kits are very cheap and easy to install. The instruction on the package are usually excellent. You may get away with just a new flapper valve. -
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Re: Toilet ball cock falls too soon
Tue, August 16, 2005 - 9:30 PMI've replaced the entire toilet mechanisms a number of times, and the current equipment is new. But I before I posted this thread, I tried replacing the flapper valve, to no effect.
Still a weak flush. -
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Re: Toilet ball cock falls too soon
Tue, August 16, 2005 - 10:55 PMyou guys are all looking at this from the wrong angle - you need to adjust the amount of water flowing into the toilet when it fills up - theres not enough water for the flush, is what it sounds like -
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Re: Toilet ball cock falls too soon
Wed, August 17, 2005 - 2:15 AMthis is a good consideration.
You might want to also look at where the water is coming in, cause once you flush, the water starts flowing. Maybe if you move the hose so it is creating a current that helps the ball cock stay open, it will give you a good flush ending. And you should have the floater adjusted so the tank is filling properly. 1.6 gallons is typical for water efficient toilets these days.
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Re: Toilet ball cock falls too soon
Wed, August 17, 2005 - 5:55 AMAndy wrote:
>"I've replaced the entire toilet mechanisms a number of times, and the current equipment is new."<
There are several possible issues. First to answer your earlier query there is a amall amount of water left in the tank when flushing. Though the complaint seems to be that the tiolet does not flush effectively.
This can be an issue of some blockage in the drain line. Water has to have some place to go in a ready manner or you are going to have a weak flow.
Second and more likely is that it is an older comode that does not have a glazed trap. This basically means the shit and other debris does not evacuate in a timely manner. This also is the reason so much more water was needed to do the same job as the current 1.6 or less units use now.
The way I would approach the issue is first, if this is a multi unit dwelling ask thier neighbors if they are having problems. This can tell you if it is in the unit or in the building. If it is in the building you are gonna need a power snake/ cutter. If it is in the unit then the issue likely lies in the comode.
Lets assume it is in the comode.
I would snake the unit. Likely culprits are feminine Hygine products. Toys and or wads of shit and paper especially if it is an unglazed trap.
If that is not the problem I would closely inspect holes under the seat of the bowl. If enough of them are blocked the tiolet will not create the suction needed to pull the waste out. yes it is a combination of gravity and suction.
Sounds like the issue is in the porciline part not the guts.
Here's a quick link on how the unit works perhaps that will help tyou in trouble shooting it.
www.naturalhandyman.com/iip/in...i1.shtm
JSin -
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Re: Toilet ball cock falls too soon
Wed, August 17, 2005 - 6:02 AM -
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This is the maximum depth. Additional responses will not be threaded.
Re: Toilet ball cock falls too soon
Wed, August 17, 2005 - 6:26 AMLooking through Cliff's link I found 2 other problems to be explored. One I never knew about:
www.toiletology.com/blue-goo.shtml
the other I spaced out is the vent system... If the vent becomes occluded or clogged the tiolet will have a lazy flush accompanied by a gurgling sound or just be slow flushing. You are gonna have to get on the roof and inpect the vent pipe to make sure you don't have a blockage there also.
JSin
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Re: Toilet ball cock falls too soon
Tue, August 23, 2005 - 5:02 PMEasy solution...... find a wine cork or two and attach it to the chain just high enough from the flapper that it will close, and low enough so the flapper will only close when the tank is nearly empty
