http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8?format=rss Tribe.net. Local Connections http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#0baebe27-577a-4e56-9031-1ef1a61f75b5 Heheh. Here's a great handmade example: http://www.xmission.com/~emailbox/catrun.htm Mon, 10 Sep 2007 02:59:30 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#0baebe27-577a-4e56-9031-1ef1a61f75b5 Alex 2007-09-10T02:59:30Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#fb174cb5-dfd0-4b41-b1ca-bea934577e2b Companies MAKE these??? Do you know any manufacturers? Thanks! :D Mon, 10 Sep 2007 02:42:36 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#fb174cb5-dfd0-4b41-b1ca-bea934577e2b Alex 2007-09-10T02:42:36Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#d83b9fc2-cd6f-4076-a374-ae7734563c05 That is a fantastic idea. You sound like a very responsible cat owner. The great thing about some of the cat runs I have seen is that you can make all sorts of tunnels/caves/layers for you cats too play in and climb up and you could change it every now and then so they don’t get bored . Mon, 10 Sep 2007 00:46:27 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#d83b9fc2-cd6f-4076-a374-ae7734563c05 Blueberry 2007-09-10T00:46:27Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#cf061b84-6879-43cd-94d6-d2041040aad4 <Pet People can be really weird. Some of them just refuse to apprehend that their pets are not a blessing to others. > We have people in our neighborhood that allow their dogs to run around at large. It makes me crazy. I have two dogs that are both dog aggressive with strange dogs (working on it and they are getting better...slowly), so if there are any dogs loose in the neighborhood, we can't walk them. We never allow them outside (other than our backyard) without a leash. There is a GSD down the street that is always loose when his owners are outside and always starts fights with my dogs if we walk by. I've even taken one person's border collie to the shelter (our county shelter sees such a high demand for adoptions that no animals get euthanized unless they are too sick to survive or so aggressive that they can't be placed - just going there you'll see multiple "adoption pending" stickers on every animal's info sheet) because it was going to get hit by a car. As it turned out, the dog ended up being very aggressive. It was fun trying to get it out of the back my SUV (I had a barrier in the back for my own dogs) with a catch pole because the shelter people didn't want to get near it. I absolutely hate irresponsible pet owners. I make it a point to be responsible and make sure that my dogs and cats don't cause problems with other people. We are friends with all of our neighbors and we tell them to let us know if our dogs cause them any problems. They never do. We keep them inside with us most of the time we're home, and if it's cold out, they stay in when we aren't home. Really the only time they're outside is when it's hot out or we're going to be gone for more than a few hours (if it's cold they get the back yard and laundry room to themselves). Irresponsible pet owners make the rest of us look bad. They are the reason why there are no parks in my county where dogs are allowed even on leash. Fri, 07 Sep 2007 16:51:12 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#cf061b84-6879-43cd-94d6-d2041040aad4 ~Ms. Purity~ 2007-09-07T16:51:12Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#a9b57ae0-a9b0-4f94-b2f4-6c74dc2392fc ********We did get a collar and a bell for each of the cats but the owners took them off. We even put a polite note on the collar requesting that they keep the cat inside at night and keep the collar on so that the cats would stop killing birds.************ Pet People can be really weird. Some of them just refuse to apprehend that their pets are not a blessing to others. Fri, 07 Sep 2007 12:50:20 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#a9b57ae0-a9b0-4f94-b2f4-6c74dc2392fc ALLAH God of all 2007-09-07T12:50:20Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#fb617b21-67e2-423e-bf1d-7b9c960aed97 This is like what I'm envisioning. I'm wanting to make a "kitty door" that only leads to a kennel-type area that's completely boxed in. This kennel would need to be at least 5-6 ft tall, so I could have a gate/door and have access to clean it/mow it. Until then, my kitties mostly stay inside. Fri, 07 Sep 2007 12:41:12 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#fb617b21-67e2-423e-bf1d-7b9c960aed97 Alex 2007-09-07T12:41:12Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#974c2798-9c03-49d1-a739-1fe5a5170f6a yup lots of people do the leash thing with good results. you can also get big outside cages that you can let your cat hang out in when your not out side. Fri, 07 Sep 2007 04:22:06 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#974c2798-9c03-49d1-a739-1fe5a5170f6a Blueberry 2007-09-07T04:22:06Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#f599ac8f-7cc4-44c2-a104-9a808c249f0b We did get a collar and a bell for each of the cats but the owners took them off. We even put a polite note on the collar requesting that they keep the cat inside at night and keep the collar on so that the cats would stop killing birds. It was a nice collar and bell too it was not a cheep junky one. probably cost about $6 bucks hair spray = $2 Fri, 07 Sep 2007 04:20:09 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#f599ac8f-7cc4-44c2-a104-9a808c249f0b Blueberry 2007-09-07T04:20:09Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#681c598a-8917-4fe0-9b14-678b31909f41 Good. Glad to have that behind~!! I was getting to feel like Jeremiah Johnson there for a while. Thu, 06 Sep 2007 19:43:11 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#681c598a-8917-4fe0-9b14-678b31909f41 ALLAH God of all 2007-09-06T19:43:11Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#0df24fd7-11d5-4c11-a785-a84d17f03e6d My two older cats never took to the leash idea, but my kitten is cool with it. He gets all excited because he knows he gets to go hang out with us in the yard when that leash comes out. Thu, 06 Sep 2007 17:44:39 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#0df24fd7-11d5-4c11-a785-a84d17f03e6d ~Ms. Purity~ 2007-09-06T17:44:39Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#5ff8e628-31d4-4728-8359-0719d35c6219 sooooooo funny i live on my boat and the other day i saw this little girl and her sister with two cats on leashes with collars and get this, the cats were totally used to the collars and seemed not to really care. while i am not sure if this had to do with the fact that they were walking on a dock above water and thought a lifeline would be cool i do think that if treated like dogs in the all animal pets must be on leash type of way this problem wouldnt happen as much. take this as a grain of salt as i really dont care and i think cats are worthless unless you have a rodent problem i just thought the observation i made would lighten the topic a bit. cliff needs a cliff bar hahaha Thu, 06 Sep 2007 16:30:56 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#5ff8e628-31d4-4728-8359-0719d35c6219 RICK 2007-09-06T16:30:56Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#fa99cbc9-9b96-4727-a4a3-374da7636915 Wouldn't a collar with bells (or a bell that you can add to their original collar) cost just as much as a can of blue spray paint? Thu, 06 Sep 2007 05:17:09 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#fa99cbc9-9b96-4727-a4a3-374da7636915 mcav0y 2007-09-06T05:17:09Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#a5f5a90a-27a1-4dc9-9a51-0af52f273fb3 Yeah, we can bury the hatchet. Thu, 06 Sep 2007 03:06:40 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#a5f5a90a-27a1-4dc9-9a51-0af52f273fb3 ~Ms. Purity~ 2007-09-06T03:06:40Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#11e6242e-0f94-413d-a202-0328a7a8409e to Jana The owner of that cat does have control over where it goes and what it does. I mention in my posts that this was not a problem with the cats but a problem with owners. - Firstly they could have considered not getting a cat when we live right next to a reserve which has lots of rare native birds. -secondly they could keep their cat indoors at night, which is when they tend to catch native birds. - Thirdly they should put a collar with a bell on their cats, so that they cannot sneak up on birds. I think that all of the above are not all too much to expect really? Do you? My dad started with quite a respectable way of sending a message to the owners, buying them a collar and bell and putting it on the cats with note when they were seen hanging around. But the owners were too irresponsible to do any thing. Yes I could spray a water gun or make noise but that would just teach the cats to say out of our yard not teach the owner how to be a responsible pet owner. Or stop the Cats from butchering endangerd native wild life for fun. Thu, 06 Sep 2007 02:22:53 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#11e6242e-0f94-413d-a202-0328a7a8409e Blueberry 2007-09-06T02:22:53Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#33e1d95b-5d72-44ea-9a3a-3fa8ff359978 *********I was led to believe by my dad, who hunts with a crossbow that it was just as quick to die that way. He's a dick though, I should probably stop listening to him.************ If I hunted with a bow I'd most likely tell people that it was efficient and painless too. Who wants to announce to people that one causes massive pain and suffering in the pursuit of a hobby - or even dinner. Which of course would reasonably lead people to convince themselves that they are correct. No one wants to think of themselves as bad people. Which brings me round to wondering if we ought not to call off this little grudge match we have seem to carried from one tribe to another. How about it? Wanna bury the hatchet? Thu, 06 Sep 2007 01:15:18 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#33e1d95b-5d72-44ea-9a3a-3fa8ff359978 ALLAH God of all 2007-09-06T01:15:18Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#9fe8cfd2-13eb-4bfc-9515-01598d794598 My bad, I didn't realize how bad it was since I have NO experience with a crossbow. Ok, I concede hunting with a crossbow. I was led to believe by my dad, who hunts with a crossbow that it was just as quick to die that way. He's a dick though, I should probably stop listening to him. Thu, 06 Sep 2007 00:02:52 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#9fe8cfd2-13eb-4bfc-9515-01598d794598 ~Ms. Purity~ 2007-09-06T00:02:52Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#c5dc0979-82c7-475c-ba77-967b47f8a475 *******Stabbing? Huh? Are you talking about my comment of hunting with a crossbow to give the animal a chance to get away? A well placed shot with a crossbow is instantaneously lethal.********** Clearly you have never gone bow hunting. There is no more painful way to be killed. A bullet travels so fast that it shocks the nerves into silence a torso hit can send the entire body into shock but you don't feel much at all. An arrow or crossbow bolt is not supersonic. It stabs it's way into the body and is ghastly painful. I can't think of a more painful way to go and I have been around weapons all my life. Wed, 05 Sep 2007 23:50:46 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#c5dc0979-82c7-475c-ba77-967b47f8a475 ALLAH God of all 2007-09-05T23:50:46Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#10f46326-401e-4104-bffe-337a6115e49a <At any rate I think stabbing a poor woodland creature to death (which is what you suggested) places you in a very precarious position for criticizing others. There is nothing more painful than stabbing short of being burnt alive. > Stabbing? Huh? Are you talking about my comment of hunting with a crossbow to give the animal a chance to get away? A well placed shot with a crossbow is instantaneously lethal. Wed, 05 Sep 2007 21:36:05 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#10f46326-401e-4104-bffe-337a6115e49a ~Ms. Purity~ 2007-09-05T21:36:05Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#96a4c7bc-6075-475e-be29-9bea3e53b6e3 ********And exactly what is wrong with keeping them out of my veggie beds with row covers? It's not like I'm poisoning them.********* It is the stabbing death which you advocated for harmless woodland animals that caused me concern. Do you want the link? Wed, 05 Sep 2007 20:44:53 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#96a4c7bc-6075-475e-be29-9bea3e53b6e3 ALLAH God of all 2007-09-05T20:44:53Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#632c8bfd-6ca2-4cd2-8807-1053804a4261 It was the suggestion that you prefer to stab harmless woodland animals to death that caused me the concern. Do you want the link? Wed, 05 Sep 2007 20:41:49 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#632c8bfd-6ca2-4cd2-8807-1053804a4261 ALLAH God of all 2007-09-05T20:41:49Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#797c8de2-c8b8-4c9f-88d9-3f16186884d2 *******I did some research on your claims that this is a quick, painless death for animals.************ Clearly not enough. ********* It is not.********* That runs contrary to the facts on the ground. I have seen animals ingest them. they die within mere minutes. People too die and it only takes one lousy newt. Not a thing to take lightly. ********Many times, it appears the newt gets away because it causes stinging in the mouth so the animal drops it before eating it. If eaten, it will most likely be vomited back up, again, causing little harm. However, if it is not vomited back up it can lead to death.************** All of which presupposes a means of administration that is not intended to accomplish a humane end. At any rate I think stabbing a poor woodland creature to death (which is what you suggested) places you in a very precarious position for criticizing others. There is nothing more painful than stabbing short of being burnt alive. Wed, 05 Sep 2007 20:40:11 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#797c8de2-c8b8-4c9f-88d9-3f16186884d2 ALLAH God of all 2007-09-05T20:40:11Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#ccd004b7-1adc-4c92-ac86-33ec5f8fd804 I feel that cats should have the same laws that restrict "at large" dogs to be put on them. I have three cats and keep them in my house 100% of the time because I don't want them to be a nuisance to my neighbors AND it keeps them healthier and safer. I try to educate as many as I can to the risks of cats being outdoors. You could always print out something like this: http://www.co.san-bernardino.ca.us/acc/documents/what_indoor_cat_misses.pdf and put it in the mailboxes of your cat owning neighbors. Wed, 05 Sep 2007 19:45:14 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#ccd004b7-1adc-4c92-ac86-33ec5f8fd804 ~Ms. Purity~ 2007-09-05T19:45:14Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#471c608a-da1d-4e85-8a5a-fa3e0430e199 "I use row covers for veggie beds. Two birds...One Stone." It doesn't work for me. The <insert expletive here> cats just poop on the fabric. IMHO people with neighbors should keep their cats indoors or be willing to accept that some people might choose to do bad things to them. I am so sick of cleaning my neighbors' cats' crap out of my garden, my lawn, my shoes, my son's clothes... YUCK! It's enough that we have to clean our own cat box. Wed, 05 Sep 2007 19:15:50 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#471c608a-da1d-4e85-8a5a-fa3e0430e199 Lianna 2007-09-05T19:15:50Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#c4c235dc-dcba-45dd-ba78-bd2925695997 Yep I saw that thread. Wed, 05 Sep 2007 19:15:34 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#c4c235dc-dcba-45dd-ba78-bd2925695997 ~Ms. Purity~ 2007-09-05T19:15:34Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#79038eea-2f50-45db-a883-f97327e7a916 <SPCA who will kill them much more cruelly than you would if you went to Oregon captured a few Rough Skinned newts and mixed 'em up with cat food and served the mixture to the cats. > I did some research on your claims that this is a quick, painless death for animals. It is not. Many times, it appears the newt gets away because it causes stinging in the mouth so the animal drops it before eating it. If eaten, it will most likely be vomited back up, again, causing little harm. However, if it is not vomited back up it can lead to death. <http://www.workingdogs.com/doc0175.htm> Salamanders (California newt Taricha torosa)—Found in California, this is the only poisonous salamander in the United States. Symptoms are weakness and in- coordination, vomiting and diarrhea (more common in puppies) and paralysis. Poisoning episodes are generally self-limiting, but may be reduced in duration by flushing the dog's mouth with copious quantities of water. http://www.peteducation.com/article.cfm?cls=2&cat=1681&articleid=2394 Toxin Toad and salamander venom Source All toads secrete mucus through the skin that does not taste good to other animals. Some toads, however, are actually poisonous. These include the tropical toads Bufo alvarius (Colorado River Toad) found in the Southwest desert and Bufo marinus found in Florida and Hawaii. Some other species of Bufotoads in other areas of the U.S. produce a milder venom. There is one species of poisonous salamander, the California Newt, which is found in California. General Information The toxin is produced by glands in the skin of these toads. The toxic agent is similar to the heart medication digoxin. Exposure is usually through oral exposure (the cat or dog mouthing the toad), but the toxin may also be absorbed through wounds or broken skin. There have been reports of toxicities from toads sitting in the pet's water dish. Toxic Dose Oral exposure to Bufo marinus can be fatal. The deadly effects can be seen within 15 minutes. Signs The venom is locally irritating causing head shaking, drooling, vocalizations, pawing at the mouth, retching, or vomiting. The mucus membranes may become red. In severe cases, heart rhythm disorders occur which may cause apparent blindness, seizures, collapse, and death. Immediate Action Very carefully wash mouth with large amounts of water such as from a slow moving stream of water from a hose. Seek veterinary attention. Veterinary Care General treatment: The animal's oral cavity and other exposed areas will be flushed with large amounts of water. Ideally, this is performed under anesthesia so the entire mouth and throat are rinsed. Activated charcoal may be administered. Supportive treatment: The animal will be monitored with an EKG and treated for heart rhythm abnormalities with a drug such as propranolol. IV fluids will be administered to maintain hydration, and any seizures. Atropine may be given to help control the drooling if no heart abnormalities are present. Sedation may be necessary. http://www.infovets.com/healthycatsinfo/E835.htm#Salamander Salamander Poisoning: The California newt, Taricha torosa, secretes a poison that can cause poisoning if the newt is picked up or swallowed by a pet. Clinical Signs: The poison causes weakness, incoordination, vomiting, diarrhea, and paralysis. Diagnosis: Diagnosis is based on a history of exposure to the newt and clinical signs of illness. Treatment: Treatment includes removal of the newt, flushing the mouth with copious amounts of water, and supportive care. There is no antidote. Many animals recover without therapy. Prevention: Prevention involves limiting pets’ access to lizards and salamanders. Pets should not be encouraged to play with or hunt lizards and salamanders. Wed, 05 Sep 2007 19:15:07 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#79038eea-2f50-45db-a883-f97327e7a916 ~Ms. Purity~ 2007-09-05T19:15:07Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#7e75cf2b-749a-45ea-9c13-2b8fd7cf9d9b for future reference... any threads you see about dogs or cats, ignore any posts cliff makes. he'll just tell you to kill it. he did it before on a barking dog thread. Wed, 05 Sep 2007 19:02:57 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#7e75cf2b-749a-45ea-9c13-2b8fd7cf9d9b lolmatt 2007-09-05T19:02:57Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#c6f7c4ae-c26d-424d-9808-f73b9607b8eb Hey hey hey!! Calm down everybody!! - we are just having a little chat about kitties! Wed, 05 Sep 2007 18:21:56 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#c6f7c4ae-c26d-424d-9808-f73b9607b8eb Mrs.Purple 2007-09-05T18:21:56Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#1473d573-70be-4321-9eb9-18d6742719a0 And exactly what is wrong with keeping them out of my veggie beds with row covers? It's not like I'm poisoning them. Wed, 05 Sep 2007 16:57:21 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#1473d573-70be-4321-9eb9-18d6742719a0 ~Ms. Purity~ 2007-09-05T16:57:21Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#32630e6f-f02c-492a-9f5b-f7bf9ba10365 Sorry I forgot a hypen. I can see how that would confuse you. I did NOT say my cats "stay indoors, only because of people like Cliff:" I said that my cats are indoor-only because of people like Cliff. There are many other reasons, disease, I don't want them pooping in my yard, fights, getting hit by cars, etc. <And yet you are willing (at least you have expressed approval of it) to torture wild animals to death using one of the most painful forms of execution imaginable. > I'm ok with hunting for food, yes, but I'm not ok with hunting for shits and giggles (as I have also stated). I'm also ok with <gasp> lion's killing other animals for food too. I'm also NOT ok with killing SOMEONE ELSE'S pet (considered private property under the law) because they cause you some discomfort. Would you be ok with killing someone's kid because they were noisy or poisoning them for going on your property rather than talk to the parents? Or what about blowing up someone's car because you thought the alarm went off too much on it? And as for trapping them and taking them to the shelter, at least then the animal has a fairly good chance of being found by the owner (and with a fine, a lesson learned) or adopted by someone else. Plus the SPCA is no-kill unless the animal is so sick or so aggressive it can't be helped. Wed, 05 Sep 2007 16:52:26 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#32630e6f-f02c-492a-9f5b-f7bf9ba10365 ~Ms. Purity~ 2007-09-05T16:52:26Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#b1eebd94-368d-4b53-94ef-dd8b7d4b9bb0 Wild animals, mind you, whose only crime was to be in the wilderness eating leaves and such. Wed, 05 Sep 2007 16:32:53 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#b1eebd94-368d-4b53-94ef-dd8b7d4b9bb0 ALLAH God of all 2007-09-05T16:32:53Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#3d42cef4-c592-4f8a-a438-6fc3d75da605 **************only because of people like Cliff*************** So then the only reason you are NOT willing to inflict your animals onto other people causing them no end of frustration and property damage is because some body might deal with them by eliminating them painlessly? And yet you are willing (at least you have expressed approval of it) to torture wild animals to death using one of the most painful forms of execution imaginable. Some people just confuse me at every turn . Wed, 05 Sep 2007 16:16:45 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#3d42cef4-c592-4f8a-a438-6fc3d75da605 ALLAH God of all 2007-09-05T16:16:45Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#a25a977d-786a-4a14-a4ab-6becfd3e11c3 i read online that fox's and coyote's will, if given the chance, prey on housecats. just go to http://www.predatorpee.com/ and buy your predator pee there. its so funny they actually sell that stuff, it probably smells pretty nasty...... Wed, 05 Sep 2007 15:55:52 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#a25a977d-786a-4a14-a4ab-6becfd3e11c3 $item.owner.firstName 2007-09-05T15:55:52Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#a027fc16-56d3-4542-8c85-8b6f474a181b <For flower or veggie beds I recommend bird netting, - that held off my cats when I was planting., as I dont shoo them out of my own garden.. > I use row covers for veggie beds. Two birds...One Stone. Not only does it keep the neighborhood cats (my cats are all indoor only because of people like Cliff) and squirrels out, but it keeps pest infestations from occuring AND it extends the season. Wed, 05 Sep 2007 15:08:36 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#a027fc16-56d3-4542-8c85-8b6f474a181b ~Ms. Purity~ 2007-09-05T15:08:36Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#8d395566-ca7b-4d62-ab47-2fb8e49f4e4a I have that sprinkler to keep the dogs out of the garden beds. It works fantastic!!!! It's called a Scarecrow. I highly recommend it. Only hint, don't inadvertantly walk in front of it without turning it off! Wed, 05 Sep 2007 14:38:44 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#8d395566-ca7b-4d62-ab47-2fb8e49f4e4a ~Ms. Purity~ 2007-09-05T14:38:44Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#88806116-8490-4e06-b2dc-6bfb61512c27 ***********So then he got a cant of ]blue hair spray and when he found cats in the yard is painted a blue stripe of hair spray down their back.************ Rotflmao that is funny~!! Wed, 05 Sep 2007 13:10:26 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#88806116-8490-4e06-b2dc-6bfb61512c27 ALLAH God of all 2007-09-05T13:10:26Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#d9eed64d-16d5-47d2-be30-f4cf40890f67 Like this? http://people.tribe.net/photogr/photos/10398f66-f6c8-456e-ae30-caa696c92aee ;] Wed, 05 Sep 2007 08:42:45 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#d9eed64d-16d5-47d2-be30-f4cf40890f67 $item.owner.firstName 2007-09-05T08:42:45Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#dd22e7d2-6ae4-4c8f-86b0-7e1780efc65c oh, gaytha,- maybe you have a friend with a cat chaser dog? You could take it on holiday and have him guard the porch for a few days.. that should also make the cats think twice before entering again.. Otherwise drape bird netting. Here in Switzerland a lot of people keep cats in apartments and stop them from going outside by this white stronger netting, draped over the balcony up to the one above, so sealing the balcony for cat exit/entry. like so: http://www.sperrmuell-entruempelung-haushaltsaufloesung.de/Bilder/Katzen_Netz_neu.JPG good luck! Wed, 05 Sep 2007 07:24:46 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#dd22e7d2-6ae4-4c8f-86b0-7e1780efc65c Mrs.Purple 2007-09-05T07:24:46Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#01ed3007-7145-40a2-b107-721884db7e19 Cats are creatures of resonable intelligence, and if they had a bad experience (give or take a couple more to be sure..) then they usually get the message. I tell my neighbors they are free to set the garden hose on them when they see them. Yes, they will come back a few more times to check if it was just a freak occurrence.. but it shouldnt take more than three or four times getting the hose on them and shouting a bit... So investing in a system might be a bit of overkill.. For flower or veggie beds I recommend bird netting, - that held off my cats when I was planting., as I dont shoo them out of my own garden.. -and to blueberry: The owner of that cat has no control over where his cat goes, so no amount of notifying will make any difference. Cats are not dogs. Cats have free will, thats what makes them appealling. You probably just terrified the owner and he is locking his poor cat indoors now for fear you might hurt it (and that wouldnt be the first time that happened..) SO: next time, just make the effort to shoo the cat with loud and strict determination, water guns and much hullabaloo,- maybe do it for a couple more times,- but then you should find the cat will avoid such commotion. Cats can be educated!- Wed, 05 Sep 2007 07:17:25 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#01ed3007-7145-40a2-b107-721884db7e19 Mrs.Purple 2007-09-05T07:17:25Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#2e6f2e0c-c883-4c82-8429-36faeb589d07 How about catching them and dressing them in silly outfits? This will really deter them from coming back. Wed, 05 Sep 2007 02:10:20 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#2e6f2e0c-c883-4c82-8429-36faeb589d07 $item.owner.firstName 2007-09-05T02:10:20Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#c2b2a6f5-b98c-46ee-8169-ad70d8914589 I'd second the motion detector garden hose sprayer thingamabob for the cats. they hate water and sudden wet surprises, plus you don't have to do the work and catch them at it yourself. oh and cliff, in CA I believe that a cat can't be considered property in the way a dog can. must be because of their *superior intelligence* so I'm sure the blue hair spray DID hurt them Blueberry...but only their ego! which may prove to be the ultimate cat repellant after all HA~! Wed, 05 Sep 2007 01:52:36 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#c2b2a6f5-b98c-46ee-8169-ad70d8914589 Chili 2007-09-05T01:52:36Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#53f52363-5f29-4042-a39f-f2634051013c This sounds a bit weird. But we have lots and lots of cats that hang out in our yard, it is a real problem beacuse they scear away all of the native birds. My dad started of puting a little note on the collar of the cats to let the owners know that they were roming around not just in their own yards and were eating the wild birds. Unfortunatly they did not get the message. So then he got a cant of ]blue hair spray and when he found cats in the yard is painted a blue stripe of hair spray down their back. It did not hurt the cats at all but it got the message through to the owners, and the cats are't left to roam the street all night any more. Wed, 05 Sep 2007 01:40:48 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#53f52363-5f29-4042-a39f-f2634051013c Blueberry 2007-09-05T01:40:48Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#18f2c56d-7c28-4e92-8110-8a75c4f9f44b It started with one cat that pissed. That attracted others. They attracted others. After a while they became comfortable with each other's presence. I have found that a strong bleach solution will dissipate the cat piss stench. I'd suggest suing the owners - but you probably can't find them and cat ownership may be a vague notion on CA law I can't say I'm not in CA. The best course might be to use those live catch traps and set about trapping them and handing them over to SPCA who will kill them much more cruelly than you would if you went to Oregon captured a few Rough Skinned newts and mixed 'em up with cat food and served the mixture to the cats. Which latter course of action would get the Animal people after you with felony warrants in their hands. Go figure. Wed, 05 Sep 2007 00:42:19 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#18f2c56d-7c28-4e92-8110-8a75c4f9f44b ALLAH God of all 2007-09-05T00:42:19Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#127c8328-a219-488c-bbfa-cc57ade79e6d Is there a sliding glass door the the porch? <A HREF="http://youtube.com/watch?v=0ZwhsD5XMC8">Pest slingshot.</A> For all your furry mammal removal needs. Wed, 05 Sep 2007 00:00:03 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#127c8328-a219-488c-bbfa-cc57ade79e6d Matt 2007-09-05T00:00:03Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#1d41ffae-178d-469e-ae47-b4e10c52d31b Thank you! Tue, 04 Sep 2007 23:37:41 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#1d41ffae-178d-469e-ae47-b4e10c52d31b GAYTHA 2007-09-04T23:37:41Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#32252085-60aa-4642-9642-274184428cb5 You may want to read: http://www.waynesthisandthat.com/catwars2.htm The motion detector sprinkler is supposed to work well. My folks used it on raccoons that were stealing the fish from their pond and it worked great! Tue, 04 Sep 2007 22:25:52 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#32252085-60aa-4642-9642-274184428cb5 Dan10things 2007-09-04T22:25:52Z http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#66236003-de4a-41a8-ace6-d13fada814f3 What can I use to deter the darn cats? I have the only high and comfy porches on the block; all the cats i9n the 'hood have taken claim to them. The back porch has also been reeking of cat piss. I sprayed the area with bleach to rid the smell- but I really want to just keep them out of my yard. Unfortunately, I'm unable to have a dog at this rental unit- or I would and train it to eat cats. Is there a citronella based product that will deter them from shitting in my yard and pissing and loitering on my porches? I'm willing to invest money in a sprinkler system even! Tue, 04 Sep 2007 21:13:49 GMT http://do-it-yourself.tribe.net/thread/7eea042a-61c4-485f-bbd2-301f2ebe3ec8#66236003-de4a-41a8-ace6-d13fada814f3 GAYTHA 2007-09-04T21:13:49Z